Developer License Questions

[xbox720]

From the Developer license (http://www.vivvo.net/license_agreement.php) ".. you are granted a license as a single individual to install and run the SOFTWARE PRODUCT royalty-free with an unlimited number of different solutions to an unlimited number of web servers, provided they are developed solely by you. The term "different solutions" is understood to mean non-identical, non-"shrink-wrapped" applications to be resold or re-licensed by you. You may not distribute the product with more than 10 copies of an identical or similarly-functioning ("shrink-wrapped") solution or application.
At no time may the SOFTWARE PRODUCT be used by more than one individual at the same time for development purposes - nor may the SOFTWARE PRODUCT be distributed for use with applications other than those developed by you."

These lines are a bit confusing. Please Clarify. Because they are all possible scenarios.

a) If some one (client) requires a flavor of Vivvo must they let the developer handle their server/hosting account ?

b)Can the client modify the copy of Vivvo they got from their Developer according to their needs ? Is that legal. Do they receive updates from their developer life long.

c) Can a developer start giving away/or freely install modified Vivvo packages (just minor changes in code and simple additions just to subvert the "shrink wrapping" clause) calling them a different solution/name for every 10 packages and provide life long/or some updates -provided, every 11th copy is different (even just a few lines of non sense code apart). Is it legal then.

d) What if 500 people formed an online group and pooled money $2 each (through paypal ) and bought a developer solution under one guy's name and start using vivvo on all their sites (slightly modified) with/without vivvo logo, wouldn't it be legal! And won't they get updates for life or at least for the developer's license period (at $2 a person that would be a steal)!

e) If a true developer want to do just the same- Can a person create a site and collect donations through paypal for their free web development portal (not stating that they want to buy Vivvo developer's license- publicly) and once the sum is accumulated can they start churning out free copies and updates (for the donated members). Is that legal.
(I wonder if someone does that after this post!) ;)

The last two scenarios I think are very much a possibility. Because if everyone start paying indirectly, the price will be a fraction or even nothing, if ad revenues for that Dev site are enough to sustain. And that license can be updated indefinitely. The developer here is only developing sites for their clients, so nothing wrong with that.

Well it would be really nice if some one from the company give these questions some answers.

[Mark]

From the Developer license (http://www.vivvo.net/license_agreement.php) ".. you are granted a license as a single individual to install and run the SOFTWARE PRODUCT royalty-free with an unlimited number of different solutions to an unlimited number of web servers, provided they are developed solely by you. The term "different solutions" is understood to mean non-identical, non-"shrink-wrapped" applications to be resold or re-licensed by you. You may not distribute the product with more than 10 copies of an identical or similarly-functioning ("shrink-wrapped") solution or application.
At no time may the SOFTWARE PRODUCT be used by more than one individual at the same time for development purposes - nor may the SOFTWARE PRODUCT be distributed for use with applications other than those developed by you."

These lines are a bit confusing. Please Clarify. Because they are all possible scenarios.

a) If some one (client) requires a flavor of Vivvo must they let the developer handle their server/hosting account ?



A single developer license implies a single point of contact (single developer) with our support. In other words, your clients cannot register and seek technical support for their Vivvo sites, only the developer holding a license can.



b)Can the client modify the copy of Vivvo they got from their Developer according to their needs ? Is that legal. Do they receive updates from their developer life long.



They can modify their copies as much as they want, but that could limit the amount of support we can provide to them. Please read our SLA for that. They will received free updates for one year.



c) Can a developer start giving away/or freely install modified Vivvo packages (just minor changes in code and simple additions just to subvert the "shrink wrapping" clause) calling them a different solution/name for every 10 packages and provide life long/or some updates -provided, every 11th copy is different (even just a few lines of non sense code apart). Is it legal then.



Let's first clarify that there are no lifelong updates, and that you would have to renew your developer license annually. I think that most people have a good idea of what "shrink wrapping" mean, but we would have to charge you $400/h if you want a nice legal brief on that topic :)



d) What if 500 people formed an online group and pooled money $2 each (through paypal ) and bought a developer solution under one guy's name and start using vivvo on all their sites (slightly modified) with/without vivvo logo, wouldn't it be legal! And won't they get updates for life or at least for the developer's license period (at $2 a person that would be a steal)!



The simple is answer is no. Unless 500 people want to have a single point of contact with our team, i.e. you :) Our corporate license is more suitable for such cases.



e) If a true developer want to do just the same- Can a person create a site and collect donations through paypal for their free web development portal (not stating that they want to buy Vivvo developer's license- publicly) and once the sum is accumulated can they start churning out free copies and updates (for the donated members). Is that legal.
(I wonder if someone does that after this post!) ;)

The last two scenarios I think are very much a possibility. Because if everyone start paying indirectly, the price will be a fraction or even nothing, if ad revenues for that Dev site are enough to sustain. And that license can be updated indefinitely. The developer here is only developing sites for their clients, so nothing wrong with that.

Well it would be really nice if some one from the company give these questions some answers.

These are very interesting questions for a legal practitioner or a scholar interested in intelectual property issues. There are several names that come to mind, including Larry Lessig, Yochai Benkler, Jessica Litman, etc., but those discussions are probably beyond the scope of this forum.

In short, the developer license is for a single developer not for multiple individuals developing their own websites. Our Corporate license would be more suitable for an environment where there are multiple developers/webmasters and where multiple points of contact are absolutely essential.

Can a single developer develop an infinite number of websites within a year and get our full support? If you have found such a person, we want to hire him/her:)

[xbox720]

The simple is answer is no. Unless 500 people want to have a single point of contact with our team, i.e. you

So is it legal to have such an arrangement, if they want only updates, but no support or just the package with private labeling.



In short, the developer license is for a single developer not for multiple individuals developing their own websites. Our Corporate license would be more suitable for an environment where there are multiple developers/webmasters and where multiple points of contact are absolutely essential.

Can a single developer develop an infinite number of websites within a year and get our full support? If you have found such a person, we want to hire him/her:)

Thanks for clarifying most of my doubts Mark. I apologize for my lack of legal knowledge.

Please assume that the clients are all ok with tech issues and can rectify problems on their own or through other forums.

Let's put Support aside ( and updates can be distributed by the developer so no problem).

a) How do you know that the clients of that developer are the ones who actually modified the code in/ developed their sites and not the licensed developer who gave them the package.

b) Clients developing their Vivvo sites on their own (with a copy of Developer licensed version from their developer) -Is that a legal/moral issue or a technical one which you can address.

c) How can you assure the buyers (assume they are tech guys) that they get the exclusivity for what they are paying (besides support).

To simplify this further, here is a scenario.
X buys a Professional license for full price. Pays extra for "Branding Free". A bunch of people pool up and get the developer license for a significantly less effective price, legally. And it comes without any Branding. Is that a possibility or not.

Thank you

[Mark]

So is it legal to have such an arrangement, if they want only updates, but no support or just the package with private labeling.



Thanks for clarifying most of my doubts Mark. I apologize for my lack of legal knowledge.

Please assume that the clients are all ok with tech issues and can rectify problems on their own or through other forums.

Let's put Support aside ( and updates can be distributed by the developer so no problem).

a) How do you know that the clients of that developer are the ones who actually modified the code in/ developed their sites and not the licensed developer who gave them the package.



Obviously, it is not possible to verify whether the developer modified the code him/herself or whether he/she gave it to someone else to modify. From our point of view, what is important is that there is a single person using this license and single point of contact with our team. Some of our Developer licensees develop only 3-4 websites per year, but some develop many more; from our experience, the Developer licenses are mainly purchased by busy professionals who demand a high level of flexibility and premium support from our team, without having to worry about upgrading their licenses every couple of months.



b) Clients developing their Vivvo sites on their own (with a copy of Developer licensed version from their developer) -Is that a legal/moral issue or a technical one which you can address.

c) How can you assure the buyers (assume they are tech guys) that they get the exclusivity for what they are paying (besides support)



First, let me clarify that the Developer License does NOT give you the reselling rights for Vivvo, it just gives you the flexibility and convenience to develop as many sites as you can. Again, this means a single developer, i.e. a person, not an organization. Technically, all licensed Vivvo websites are in our client database and are verified, and the Developer licensees also send information about the sites that they develop back to Spoonlabs. As far as moral/ethical issues are concerned, I guess you can always try to cheat on the terms of your license (and probably get caught), but it seems easier to just get a pirated copy of the software instead of doing that. We can't stop piracy, but we can and will definitely fight it.

The Developer license does not just give you support, it gives you premium support and access to Developer's documentation and all the Vivvo goodies that we frequently release into the clients' area. It is not just quantitatively, but QUALITATIVELY different from our Standard/Professional licenses.


To simplify this further, here is a scenario.
X buys a Professional license for full price. Pays extra for "Branding Free". A bunch of people pool up and get the developer license for a significantly less effective price, legally. And it comes without any Branding. Is that a possibility or not.

Thank you

From a legal point of view, "a bunch of people" cannot pool up and buy the Developer license, as it is meant for a single developer, not for a multiple individuals developing their own websites.

Most of the above questions are actually more interesting in theory than in practice. In practice, our clients buy the Developer license because it offers them a piece of mind, knowing that they get all the new updates, plugins, widgets, etc. as soon as they are released, premium technical support, and freedom to get really busy with their work and develop as many sites as they can.

Our Corporate license is aimed at organizations where multiple individuals develop Vivvo websites and hence need more intensive contacts with our support as well as direct access to the development team. From the scenarios you've mentioned, I gather that your needs may be better served by the Corporate license. We would be happy to look into your specific requirements and provide you with a customized quote for the Corporate license; please email our sales team, and they will get back to you asap.

Again, thanks for your interest in Vivvo and your contributions to this forum.